4.3L Starter

[9Ball]

Ok .... So yesterday, I took my girlfriends 2 sons(24-26 yrs old) and one of their girlfriends out on the boat fishing(for the 1st time on my boat), everything was going great, we made 2 stops to try and catch some fish, wellllll nothing was biting so we decided to try another spot but, the boat wouldn't start, the starter would not engage.... every time I'd hit the key the starter would just hit the flywheel, we tried everything to get it to work, but no joy. Luckily a sail boat happened by and gave us a tow(a s-l-o-w tow, but I was very thankful that he stopped and helped us).

My questions is, do I have to use a "Marine" starter? Or can I use a automotive starter? (92-4.3L mercrusier)


BTW if you hear about somebody getting lynched by a mad woman.... Its probably me...LOL

[mcoffey]

You should stick with a Marine starter. They are sealed units to help prevent igniting fuel vapors. I have purchased from Arlington Armature (local reman shop but very good) as well as online with after-market units. If it were me, I would go with the Arlington Armature unit if you can find a local shop that sells them (or maybe they will sell direct to you).

[ss3964spd]

What Murl said Todd - marine starter. Gas vapors are heavier than air so settle to the low spots in the bilge - which is also where the starter on the 4.3 happens to be. The marine units are "ignition protected" which means they sealed to prevent internal sparks/arc's from igniting any gas vapors. When you install it be certain your connections are nice and tight - using lock washers. If those connections jiggle loose - but not necessarily come off, the lose connection can also cause a spark.

Dan

[9Ball]

Got it.... I think I am going to replace the SOLENOID, the starter spins fine, just wont engage the flywheel.

[9Ball]

I took the starter out had it tested and it passed all the test. They said to try shimming it...and I did... still the same problem... Not sure what to do next except try another starter. BTW the ring gear it good... With the weather coming I am covering up the boat untill the storm passes...

Todd

[CountryME]

9ball, need more info on your issue. In the first post you stated the starter would hit the flywheel, but not turn over the motor. Later you say it spins freely. So is your starter actually engaging or are you just hearing a click from the engine compartment? Makes a big difference on how to proceed.

-JP

[9Ball]

Originally Posted by CountryME

9ball, need more info on your issue. In the first post you stated the starter would hit the flywheel, but not turn over the motor. Later you say it spins freely. So is your starter actually engaging or are you just hearing a click from the engine compartment? Makes a big difference on how to proceed.

-JP

The starter hits the flywheel, but does not engage the Ring gear.

[mcoffey]

Not sure I follow you here Todd. The starter has a small gear in the nose cone that rests towards to body end of the starter. When engaged, the gear will jump to the top of the nose and start spinning. On the motor side of this there is a flywheel with gears welded to it that bolt to the rear of the engine. When the starter is mounted to the block (and shimmed correctly), the flywheel does not touch the starter housing or the gear. When you engage the starter, teh gear jumps up, engaging the flywheel gear and then starts cranking the engine over.

So are you saying that you hear the starter spinning but do not believe the gear is jumping up and engaging the flywheel or do you think it is engaging it but not enough for the gears to fully enage (causing it to make that awful grinding noise)?
When you bench tested it, did you verify all of this was happening and the gear was fully engaging towards the nose? Could be that it is not going all the way up (or not at all).

[ss3964spd]

Seem odd that it would be starting the engine just fine - engaging the ring gear then go to not engaging the ring gear on the same day and without changing anything. Are you able to actually see with your orbs that the starter's pinion gear is not engaging the flywheel? There is only a couple of ways that the face of the starter gear would hit the face of the ring gear. An alignment issue or the nose of the starter is cracked/broken

If you can't actually see it - just guessing that's what's happening, the first thing I'd do is put a breaker bar on the balancer bolt and make certain you can turn the crankshaft in the direction it should rotate.

Dan

[CountryME]

Were the bolts tight when you removed the starter? If they were loose, it's possible that that was your problem. Have you reinstalled it yet?

[9Ball]

Yes the bolts were tight.... Got her all secured till after the storm passes... I think the plan is.... to get a starter from the junk yard off a 4.3L S-10 pickup truck and see what happens. I am Suspecting that the bendix or solenoid might be weak. http://theboat92.shutterfly.com/pictures/171 , http://theboat92.shutterfly.com/pictures/171#170 , http://theboat92.shutterfly.com/pictures/106

[vffb507]

Okay, to understand your problem...
Try iginition.
solenoid throws starter gear out, but it does go far enough to engage flywheel
starter turns fine, but gear continues to sit just shy of the flywheel.
sound of starter is okay, just not quite as it was when working - no loading.

Have you checked the shaft and drive lever and gears? the gear and drive lever should slide manually without too much effort, the solenoid may be getting weak or things might be binding on the shaft due to damage or build-up..

[mcoffey]

I would stay away from an automotive starter unless you are just doing this as a test only. Thos units are not sealed and you will be putting yourself at greater explosion risk and the unit will most likely fail sooner due to moisture exposure.

[9Ball]

Starter update: after lots of digging around and talking to everyone I called a local Marine repair shop and talked to the sales person to order a Starter. We talked about the problem and he said that it sounds like a "Low voltage" problem, sooooo back on the web to find a wiring schematic and I think I have found the problem, the wires going to the starter have been put on the wrong post all this time. When I took the starter off I tagged the wires so I would put them back in the location where they came from, but I guess the last person to install the starter didn't. As soon as the RAIN passes(Saturday) I'll install the starter and wires in the proper locations and let everyone the outcome.

[ss3964spd]

Am struggling to understand how it would have ever started with the wiring on the wrong posts..........

Can you elaborate Todd?

Dan

[9Ball]

Me too... I am a Helicopter mechanic by trade, the only thing I know about wires is...if you let the smoke out of the wires they don't work...LOL but
Seriously I guess it will work but barely which has been the case all along, when I first got The Boat, the starter didn't sound good at all(crunchy is the only way I can describe the sound) , but the engine started. Till I guess some corrosion or something else created a voltage drop low enough that it now wont engage the flywheel. At any rate it was wired incorrectly, I found a engine wiring schematic.... and Saturday (after morning coffee) I will reinstall the starter and put the wires in the proper locations. At this point the only thing I am sure the wiring was not correct.... The solenoid has 4 prongs, 2 Large and 2 small, one Large one is power from the Battery and FUSE ASSY(90 AMP) , the other goes to the Starter motor. Now for The two small ones 1 is marked "R" (and NOT used in this application) and the other is marked "S"(Closest to the ENG), The RED/PURPLE should be attached to the Fuse (from the alternator) it wasn't, The YEL/RED (From the Starter Solenoid on top of the engine)should go on the prong marked "S", and Lastly a ORN wire (from the alternator), I am putting in a NEW FUSE ASSY-90 AMP (#88-79023A91) only $25.00.

[9Ball]

Wellllll looks like my boating days are ove this season, the engine block is cracked where the starter mounts. gezzzzzz wanted to go out a few more times before it got cold. Looks like dry dock for me till tax money comes in next year!

Todd

[ss3964spd]

Major bummer, Todd - really sucks.